Redwall Abbey

Brian Jacques' Works (Spoilers) => History, Legends and Myths => Topic started by: Matthias Martin on December 18, 2011, 12:38:32 AM

Title: Graves.
Post by: Matthias Martin on December 18, 2011, 12:38:32 AM
the topic is Graves. where do they buried the dead? and jsut like the tomb of Martin the warrior and Abbess Germine, do you think that the other founders of Redwall were place in tombs? was Goff and his family buried at redwall or at the church?
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: DanielofRedwall on December 18, 2011, 01:24:57 AM
I don't think it was ever mentions where Gonff was buried, but if it was my best bet would be it being mentioned in Doomwyte. Gonff is mentioned a lot in there. It's been ages since I've read it, though, so I can't say for sure.

Now, a lot of the time, they were buried where they liked being. I think Rose was buried at or near Noonvale (or was it on their journey?) and I can remember a lot of people were buried by the Abbey pond. Swiffo, for example, from the Rogue Crew.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Matthias Martin on December 18, 2011, 05:38:07 AM
i don't believe that the location of Goff's grave is ever given. the most tha tthey talked aobut him in that book was saying how he stole the eyes and that his family was kicked out of the abbey for stealing.

Rose was Buried at Noonvile. in the book Martin the warrior. at the end. Brome takes her body back with him to be buried there. and on top of her grave is the Rose bush.

i think that it would of been neat if they found some more tombs or hidden rooms in the Abbey
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Skipper on December 18, 2011, 09:37:15 AM
thy did mention in the taggerung that constance was buried under a tree or something and they mentioned mother mellus getting buried but i cant remember what book that was in
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Matthias Martin on December 18, 2011, 07:15:53 PM
i think that i remember that. i know that Mellus was in the books, Mariel of Redwall, and The BellMaker.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Matthias Martin on December 18, 2011, 07:43:20 PM
and another thing that i wonder too, how big was the tunnel to Martin's tomb? if i remember correctly in the book the tunnel i small and the room is small but int eh cartoon the tunnel is huge and the room is not big big but it is still big. any thoughts?
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Taggerung_of_Redwall on December 18, 2011, 08:06:22 PM
It's been awhile since I watched the series, so I can't remember.

Redwall page 134, US Firebird edition.
To the astonishment of the watching mice, the [fourth] step slid smoothly outwards on the greased stone. It turned completely over to reveal a dark opening with a downward flight of stairs running off into the blackness below.

Redwall page 141, US Firebird edition.
Below the newly discovered steps, a pair of lanterns cast pools of golden light into the inky blackness. The two mice made their way gingerly down the secret entrance.
The friends pressed onward. They could not estimate how long they had been following the course of this ancient winding corridor.

Redwall page 143 US Firebird edition.
Lanterns held high, the two mice advanced through the doorway.

It was a small, low-ceilinged chamber. A stone block rested squarely in the middle.


So, probably small, short tunnel that ran quite a long distance, and then the small room of the Martin's grave, located near the bottom of the Abbey's foundation according to this part of page 141:
"Yes, we must be nearly underneath the Abbey foundation," Matthias replied.

I'd ask that you don't post more than once in a row. You can use the 'modify' button on top of your post to add information.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: BadgerLordFiredrake on December 18, 2011, 09:14:36 PM
In Salamandastron, Lord Brocktree didn't have a grave.  He had a final resting place, by the Badger Lord Treasure.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Matthias Martin on December 18, 2011, 11:32:54 PM
sorry, i didn't see the modify button until now. i will do that next time

i always thought of that room as Brocktree's grave but in the open.
the tv series had the tunnel as being around 15 to 20 feet tall with a small room.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Coobreedan on December 20, 2011, 08:52:11 PM
Friar Hugo had a grave.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Gears on December 22, 2011, 01:59:29 AM
Alot of them got buried under the old oak tree, or by the abbey pond. Some of them were also at the church, or random locations having to do with the book.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Captain Tammo on December 22, 2011, 08:43:00 PM
I feel like they had a separate area that was a cemetery-like area. Also, I think that since they probably didn't use coffins, the bodies decomposed quickly, which is why so many are buried beneath the tree over time. And I doubt that there's only be oak tree also. So I guess all of this makes sense
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Rollo the Baby Bankvole on December 24, 2011, 07:47:25 AM
I think the Redwallers got buried in a peaceful place, like under a tree or near some place they loved.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Lutra on December 24, 2011, 11:45:03 AM
Does anyone gather that any of these graves have headstones to say who is there?  I don't think there is any mention of this, but it doesn't seem that the characters don't often revisit the graves of lost ones.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Skipper on December 24, 2011, 11:58:32 AM
i think only a couple had headstones like mother mellus, but they have some at loamhedge, they had lots of graves probably with headstones, we know some did like the first abbess their, which is where he cure was supposed to be for Martha
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Rollo the Baby Bankvole on January 01, 2012, 03:38:31 AM
I think Cregga had a headstone, I think it said a little message, like, "Here lies Cregga, loving badger,' or something, but I'm not sure.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: General Ironbeak on December 24, 2013, 01:02:38 AM
Quote from: Coobreedan on December 20, 2011, 08:52:11 PM
Friar Hugo had a grave.

How did this not get mentioned before when there is an illustration of it?
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Leatho Shellhound on December 24, 2013, 05:00:31 AM
Didn't Laterose also have a grave?
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Ungatt Trunn on December 24, 2013, 07:14:53 PM
A problem that I noticed thorought the Redwall series is that several creatures were buried in the lawns of Redwall Abbey. But, it happens quite a few times, especially towards the last books in the series, but it seems at times that there should be allot of graves, but none of them ever get noticed.   
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Kitsune on January 10, 2014, 02:24:30 AM
Maybe they only buried the abbey members who were important (i.e. abbot, badgermum) in the main area so that people could see and remember (or in a special place like Martin's tomb), and all the others were buried somewhere else in the abbey.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Tam and Martin on January 10, 2014, 01:52:34 PM
Quote from: PluggFiretail on January 10, 2014, 02:24:30 AM
Maybe they only buried the abbey members who were important (i.e. abbot, badgermum) in the main area so that people could see and remember (or in a special place like Martin's tomb), and all the others were buried somewhere else in the abbey.
Quote from: Ungatt Trunn on December 24, 2013, 07:14:53 PM
A problem that I noticed thorought the Redwall series is that several creatures were buried in the lawns of Redwall Abbey. But, it happens quite a few times, especially towards the last books in the series, but it seems at times that there should be allot of graves, but none of them ever get noticed.   
Or maybe they ere at a part of the abbey where it as set part from the rest. Like an area that no one can enter easily.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Kitsune on January 11, 2014, 02:58:07 AM
Quote from: Tam and Martin on January 10, 2014, 01:52:34 PM
Quote from: PluggFiretail on January 10, 2014, 02:24:30 AM
Maybe they only buried the abbey members who were important (i.e. abbot, badgermum) in the main area so that people could see and remember (or in a special place like Martin's tomb), and all the others were buried somewhere else in the abbey.
Quote from: Ungatt Trunn on December 24, 2013, 07:14:53 PM
A problem that I noticed thorought the Redwall series is that several creatures were buried in the lawns of Redwall Abbey. But, it happens quite a few times, especially towards the last books in the series, but it seems at times that there should be allot of graves, but none of them ever get noticed.   
Or maybe they ere at a part of the abbey where it as set part from the rest. Like an area that no one can enter easily.
I think that these are the answer! ;)
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Ungatt Trunn on January 11, 2014, 06:33:41 PM
Quote from: PluggFiretail on January 11, 2014, 02:58:07 AM
Quote from: Tam and Martin on January 10, 2014, 01:52:34 PM
Quote from: PluggFiretail on January 10, 2014, 02:24:30 AM
Maybe they only buried the abbey members who were important (i.e. abbot, badgermum) in the main area so that people could see and remember (or in a special place like Martin's tomb), and all the others were buried somewhere else in the abbey.
Quote from: Ungatt Trunn on December 24, 2013, 07:14:53 PM
A problem that I noticed thorought the Redwall series is that several creatures were buried in the lawns of Redwall Abbey. But, it happens quite a few times, especially towards the last books in the series, but it seems at times that there should be allot of graves, but none of them ever get noticed.   
Or maybe they ere at a part of the abbey where it as set part from the rest. Like an area that no one can enter easily.
I think that these are the answer! ;)
But I don't think that they would disvalue somebody's grave because he or she wasn't a Redwaller.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Tam and Martin on January 11, 2014, 07:25:36 PM
Quote from: Ungatt Trunn on January 11, 2014, 06:33:41 PM
Quote from: PluggFiretail on January 11, 2014, 02:58:07 AM
Quote from: Tam and Martin on January 10, 2014, 01:52:34 PM
Quote from: PluggFiretail on January 10, 2014, 02:24:30 AM
Maybe they only buried the abbey members who were important (i.e. abbot, badgermum) in the main area so that people could see and remember (or in a special place like Martin's tomb), and all the others were buried somewhere else in the abbey.
Quote from: Ungatt Trunn on December 24, 2013, 07:14:53 PM
A problem that I noticed thorought the Redwall series is that several creatures were buried in the lawns of Redwall Abbey. But, it happens quite a few times, especially towards the last books in the series, but it seems at times that there should be allot of graves, but none of them ever get noticed.   
Or maybe they ere at a part of the abbey where it as set part from the rest. Like an area that no one can enter easily.
I think that these are the answer! ;)
But I don't think that they would disvalue somebody's grave because he or she wasn't a Redwaller.
What?
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Ungatt Trunn on January 11, 2014, 07:39:30 PM
Quote from: Tam and Martin on January 11, 2014, 07:25:36 PM
Quote from: Ungatt Trunn on January 11, 2014, 06:33:41 PM
Quote from: PluggFiretail on January 11, 2014, 02:58:07 AM
Quote from: Tam and Martin on January 10, 2014, 01:52:34 PM
Quote from: PluggFiretail on January 10, 2014, 02:24:30 AM
Maybe they only buried the abbey members who were important (i.e. abbot, badgermum) in the main area so that people could see and remember (or in a special place like Martin's tomb), and all the others were buried somewhere else in the abbey.
Quote from: Ungatt Trunn on December 24, 2013, 07:14:53 PM
A problem that I noticed thorought the Redwall series is that several creatures were buried in the lawns of Redwall Abbey. But, it happens quite a few times, especially towards the last books in the series, but it seems at times that there should be allot of graves, but none of them ever get noticed.   
Or maybe they ere at a part of the abbey where it as set part from the rest. Like an area that no one can enter easily.
I think that these are the answer! ;)
But I don't think that they would disvalue somebody's grave because he or she wasn't a Redwaller.
What?
I'm refurring to the part were you said "no ine can enter easy". I think that they would believe that all creatures are equill,  no matter were your from. That may sound a little weird when it comes to burying creatures, but hey. Though, I'm sure that the Redwalkers might care a little more for the passing of somebody who lived at Redwall. Just not so sure about the burying. They might have had a section that was for creatures that were previous Redwallers.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Tam and Martin on January 11, 2014, 07:46:12 PM
Quote from: Ungatt Trunn on January 11, 2014, 07:39:30 PM
Quote from: Tam and Martin on January 11, 2014, 07:25:36 PM
Quote from: Ungatt Trunn on January 11, 2014, 06:33:41 PM
Quote from: PluggFiretail on January 11, 2014, 02:58:07 AM
Quote from: Tam and Martin on January 10, 2014, 01:52:34 PM
Quote from: PluggFiretail on January 10, 2014, 02:24:30 AM
Maybe they only buried the abbey members who were important (i.e. abbot, badgermum) in the main area so that people could see and remember (or in a special place like Martin's tomb), and all the others were buried somewhere else in the abbey.
Quote from: Ungatt Trunn on December 24, 2013, 07:14:53 PM
A problem that I noticed thorought the Redwall series is that several creatures were buried in the lawns of Redwall Abbey. But, it happens quite a few times, especially towards the last books in the series, but it seems at times that there should be allot of graves, but none of them ever get noticed.   
Or maybe they ere at a part of the abbey where it as set part from the rest. Like an area that no one can enter easily.
I think that these are the answer! ;)
But I don't think that they would disvalue somebody's grave because he or she wasn't a Redwaller.
What?
I'm refurring to the part were you said "no ine can enter easy". I think that they would believe that all creatures are equill,  no matter were your from. That may sound a little weird when it comes to burying creatures, but hey. Though, I'm sure that the Redwalkers might care a little more for the passing of somebody who lived at Redwall. Just not so sure about the burying. They might have had a section that was for creatures that were previous Redwallers.
What I was meaning by that is that it is not at a spot where dibbuns could run, or people could just sit down at or where it can't be disturbed.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Cornflower MM on January 11, 2014, 09:05:41 PM
Quote from: Lutra on December 24, 2011, 11:45:03 AM
Does anyone gather that any of these graves have headstones to say who is there?  I don't think there is any mention of this, but it doesn't seem that the characters don't often revisit the graves of lost ones.

There your wrong, friend. At the end of the book Taggerung, it says
QuoteThe badgermum's grave always had the prettiest flowers.
Or something like that. And, near there, the squirrels (What's their names?) are skipping, and they see some pretty flowers, so they put them in a little jar with water, and put them near the headstone.

Quote from: Leatho Shellhound on December 24, 2013, 05:00:31 AM
Didn't Laterose also have a grave?

Yes, she did. At Noonvale.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Ungatt Trunn on January 11, 2014, 09:55:23 PM
Quote from: Tam and Martin on January 11, 2014, 07:46:12 PM
Quote from: Ungatt Trunn on January 11, 2014, 07:39:30 PM
Quote from: Tam and Martin on January 11, 2014, 07:25:36 PM
Quote from: Ungatt Trunn on January 11, 2014, 06:33:41 PM
Quote from: PluggFiretail on January 11, 2014, 02:58:07 AM
Quote from: Tam and Martin on January 10, 2014, 01:52:34 PM
Quote from: PluggFiretail on January 10, 2014, 02:24:30 AM
Maybe they only buried the abbey members who were important (i.e. abbot, badgermum) in the main area so that people could see and remember (or in a special place like Martin's tomb), and all the others were buried somewhere else in the abbey.
Quote from: Ungatt Trunn on December 24, 2013, 07:14:53 PM
A problem that I noticed thorought the Redwall series is that several creatures were buried in the lawns of Redwall Abbey. But, it happens quite a few times, especially towards the last books in the series, but it seems at times that there should be allot of graves, but none of them ever get noticed.   
Or maybe they ere at a part of the abbey where it as set part from the rest. Like an area that no one can enter easily.
I think that these are the answer! ;)
But I don't think that they would disvalue somebody's grave because he or she wasn't a Redwaller.
What?
I'm refurring to the part were you said "no ine can enter easy". I think that they would believe that all creatures are equill,  no matter were your from. That may sound a little weird when it comes to burying creatures, but hey. Though, I'm sure that the Redwalkers might care a little more for the passing of somebody who lived at Redwall. Just not so sure about the burying. They might have had a section that was for creatures that were previous Redwallers.
What I was meaning by that is that it is not at a spot where dibbuns could run, or people could just sit down at or where it can't be disturbed.
Oh, alright. Though, do you think that they would have enough room for something like that?
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Tam and Martin on January 12, 2014, 01:59:15 AM
Quote from: Ungatt Trunn on January 11, 2014, 09:55:23 PM
Quote from: Tam and Martin on January 11, 2014, 07:46:12 PM
Quote from: Ungatt Trunn on January 11, 2014, 07:39:30 PM
Quote from: Tam and Martin on January 11, 2014, 07:25:36 PM
Quote from: Ungatt Trunn on January 11, 2014, 06:33:41 PM
Quote from: PluggFiretail on January 11, 2014, 02:58:07 AM
Quote from: Tam and Martin on January 10, 2014, 01:52:34 PM
Quote from: PluggFiretail on January 10, 2014, 02:24:30 AM
Maybe they only buried the abbey members who were important (i.e. abbot, badgermum) in the main area so that people could see and remember (or in a special place like Martin's tomb), and all the others were buried somewhere else in the abbey.
Quote from: Ungatt Trunn on December 24, 2013, 07:14:53 PM
A problem that I noticed thorought the Redwall series is that several creatures were buried in the lawns of Redwall Abbey. But, it happens quite a few times, especially towards the last books in the series, but it seems at times that there should be allot of graves, but none of them ever get noticed.   
Or maybe they ere at a part of the abbey where it as set part from the rest. Like an area that no one can enter easily.
I think that these are the answer! ;)
But I don't think that they would disvalue somebody's grave because he or she wasn't a Redwaller.
What?
I'm refurring to the part were you said "no ine can enter easy". I think that they would believe that all creatures are equill,  no matter were your from. That may sound a little weird when it comes to burying creatures, but hey. Though, I'm sure that the Redwalkers might care a little more for the passing of somebody who lived at Redwall. Just not so sure about the burying. They might have had a section that was for creatures that were previous Redwallers.
What I was meaning by that is that it is not at a spot where dibbuns could run, or people could just sit down at or where it can't be disturbed.
Oh, alright. Though, do you think that they would have enough room for something like that?
I would imagine that they had enough room.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Kitsune on January 12, 2014, 06:25:41 PM
It should be big enough; abbeys are the size of small castles.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Ungatt Trunn on January 13, 2014, 11:42:42 PM
Quote from: PluggFiretail on January 12, 2014, 06:25:41 PM
It should be big enough; abbeys are the size of small castles.
But haven't you seen some of the pictures of Redwall Abbey? It doesn't appear to be that large. And, even if they did have a heck of a ton of room, things could get pretty crowded over 22 books.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Kitsune on January 14, 2014, 03:11:59 PM
Quote from: Ungatt Trunn on January 13, 2014, 11:42:42 PM
Quote from: PluggFiretail on January 12, 2014, 06:25:41 PM
It should be big enough; abbeys are the size of small castles.
But haven't you seen some of the pictures of Redwall Abbey? It doesn't appear to be that large. And, even if they did have a heck of a ton of room, things could get pretty crowded over 22 books.
Those were just the artist's interpretations of Redwall. All of the drawings look similar probably because Brian described Redwall to the artist, and they looked at past pictures and drew it to be a similar size. Also, it probably isn't supposed to show much detail, just where Redwall is in comparison to landmarks of the story. Brian might have not liked this small version of the Abbey, but if it was a good picture then he might have just gone with it. Or maybe he liked the small Abbey. Maybe this should be a separate topic... (How Big was the Abbey?)
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Ungatt Trunn on January 14, 2014, 05:03:03 PM
@Plugg: Still, Redwall dosn't seem to be THAT large in the books. It dosn't really give the inpression of it being big in your imagenation when reading any Redwall book.
Oh, and that sounds like an intresting topic, "How big is Redwall Abbey?". I might start a topic like that...
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Tam and Martin on January 14, 2014, 06:29:08 PM
I agree with Plugg. They might not mention a lot of Redwall's size exactly but you can notice a few things that would make it  large like for example: The pond, The hue tree Fwirl climbs inside Redwall in The Taggerung and the big orchard.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: MeadowR on January 20, 2014, 03:08:39 PM
It's an interesting question about graves. Obviously several had their tombs and special places they were buried. How about all the other goodbeasts in the abbey, for example, maybe there was a special area that was quite like a graveyard. Shame one wasn't mentioned at any point, could've been quite disconcerting. You would think that these appreciative creatures would want their friends and families buried near the abbey and maybe not just here, there and everywhere. St Ninians seemed like a church that might have had a graveyard? Is that mentioned? If that did, even if the book was different to the later, it could suggest graveyard areas could exist. I'm just rambling now! :D
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: The Shade on January 20, 2014, 08:04:07 PM
Good point, Saint Ninians had a graveyard. It the book it mentions Cluny perching on a grave stone at one point. I would imagine that would be the place where most were buried before it was destroyed in TPOL.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Tam and Martin on January 21, 2014, 09:21:40 PM
But then they had to be buried somewhere else after it was burned.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: willruth on April 02, 2014, 06:46:32 PM
 The Graveyard could have survived?? ???
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Shadowed One on April 15, 2014, 01:15:16 PM
Quote from: Lutra on December 24, 2011, 11:45:03 AM
Does anyone gather that any of these graves have headstones to say who is there?  I don't think there is any mention of this, but it doesn't seem that the characters don't often revisit the graves of lost ones.
I think in High Rhulain it said Brinty had a headstone.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: 321tumbler on April 15, 2014, 08:44:27 PM
I think it said Leatho Shellhound made a wooden effigy for him and cast it into the lake with flowers.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Tam and Martin on April 16, 2014, 02:48:44 PM
Quote from: 321tumbler on April 15, 2014, 08:44:27 PM
I think it said Leatho Shellhound made a wooden effigy for him and cast it into the lake with flowers.
Well, at Redwall they made him a headstone. Back at Green Isle, they did what you said they did.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: 321tumbler on April 17, 2014, 01:35:09 PM
OK
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: The Skarzs on April 17, 2014, 04:30:20 PM
In Mattimeo, Friar whatshisname (I forget) had a burial stone, I believe.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Kitsune on May 19, 2014, 10:46:00 AM
Friar Hugo, I think.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: The Skarzs on May 19, 2014, 05:21:27 PM
Ah, yes.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Leatho Shellhound on May 21, 2014, 04:24:13 AM
Quote from: Ungatt Trunn on January 14, 2014, 05:03:03 PM
@Plugg: Still, Redwall dosn't seem to be THAT large in the books. It dosn't really give the inpression of it being big in your imagenation when reading any Redwall book.
Oh, and that sounds like an intresting topic, "How big is Redwall Abbey?". I might start a topic like that...

I think it is rather big, after all, why would so many vermin war lords want it.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: HeadInAnotherGalaxy on May 29, 2014, 01:00:44 AM
Quote from: Leatho Shellhound on May 21, 2014, 04:24:13 AM
Quote from: Ungatt Trunn on January 14, 2014, 05:03:03 PM
@Plugg: Still, Redwall dosn't seem to be THAT large in the books. It dosn't really give the inpression of it being big in your imagenation when reading any Redwall book.
Oh, and that sounds like an intresting topic, "How big is Redwall Abbey?". I might start a topic like that...

I think it is rather big, after all, why would some many vermin war lords want it.

Treazure iz uzually ze motive. Slagar moight 'ave 'ad ze roight idea nae tryin' tae conquer it.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Leatho Shellhound on May 31, 2014, 02:00:22 AM
Quote from: HeadInAnotherGalaxy on May 29, 2014, 01:00:44 AM
Quote from: Leatho Shellhound on May 21, 2014, 04:24:13 AM
Quote from: Ungatt Trunn on January 14, 2014, 05:03:03 PM
@Plugg: Still, Redwall dosn't seem to be THAT large in the books. It dosn't really give the inpression of it being big in your imagenation when reading any Redwall book.
Oh, and that sounds like an intresting topic, "How big is Redwall Abbey?". I might start a topic like that...

I think it is rather big, after all, why would some many vermin war lords want it.

Treazure iz uzually ze motive. Slagar moight 'ave 'ad ze roight idea nae tryin' tae conquer it.

Not usually, most of the time they wanted it for their own, as their fort. In Marfox they were after treasure though.

Indeed, and he almost succeeded.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Rusvul on June 05, 2014, 05:19:30 AM
Yes, and they failed because everybody except Mokkan was an idiot.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Tam and Martin on June 10, 2014, 11:46:11 PM
Quote from: Leatho Shellhound on May 31, 2014, 02:00:22 AM
Quote from: HeadInAnotherGalaxy on May 29, 2014, 01:00:44 AM
Quote from: Leatho Shellhound on May 21, 2014, 04:24:13 AM
Quote from: Ungatt Trunn on January 14, 2014, 05:03:03 PM
@Plugg: Still, Redwall dosn't seem to be THAT large in the books. It dosn't really give the inpression of it being big in your imagenation when reading any Redwall book.
Oh, and that sounds like an intresting topic, "How big is Redwall Abbey?". I might start a topic like that...

I think it is rather big, after all, why would some many vermin war lords want it.

Treazure iz uzually ze motive. Slagar moight 'ave 'ad ze roight idea nae tryin' tae conquer it.

Not usually, most of the time they wanted it for their own, as their fort. In Marfox they were after treasure though.

Indeed, and he almost succeeded.
Though most of the warlords claimed that there was treasure inside Redwall. That has happened in almost every Redwall book.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Leatho Shellhound on June 14, 2014, 05:00:44 AM
Quote from: Tam and Martin on June 10, 2014, 11:46:11 PM
Though most of the warlords claimed that there was treasure inside Redwall. That has happened in almost every Redwall book.

Really? I thought that was more in the book Salamandastron where the vermin were after treasure.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Tam and Martin on June 16, 2014, 08:56:38 PM
Quote from: Leatho Shellhound on June 14, 2014, 05:00:44 AM
Quote from: Tam and Martin on June 10, 2014, 11:46:11 PM
Though most of the warlords claimed that there was treasure inside Redwall. That has happened in almost every Redwall book.

Really? I thought that was more in the book Salamandastron where the vermin were after treasure.
[/quote] Salamandastron was probably where it happened most though I think I can recall a few other times it happened.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Tim Churchmouse on September 14, 2014, 07:11:23 AM
I'd have thought that until the Pearls Of Lutra they used St Ninians Church for graves, and continued using it as a cemetery.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Cornflower MM on September 14, 2014, 05:19:36 PM
Quote from: rusvulthesaber on June 05, 2014, 05:19:30 AM
Yes, and they failed because everybody except Mokkan was an idiot.

Ziral wasn't that much of an idiot, neither was Vannan. But, yes, the oneMarlfox that was least idiotic (Besides Lantur) was Mokkan. And we're really off topic here, aren't we?

Graves. Depressing subject. But interesting, nonetheless. . . . .
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: The Skarzs on September 17, 2014, 11:09:26 PM
Perhaps there is a burial ground that they use out on the plains, because the amount would be very large.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Tam and Martin on September 18, 2014, 03:44:26 PM
Only in wartimes they would be very large and usually the wars are very spread apart  :P 
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: The Skarzs on September 18, 2014, 03:46:44 PM
Except that the amount of creatures who have died over the entire series would be massive.
Oh, another idea: St. Ninian's. Perhaps there's a cemetery there that they've used; comes to sense it being a supposed church.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Tam and Martin on September 18, 2014, 03:52:57 PM
That is what several people have said but in POL, they kinda burned it. (SPOILER!!!!) They still could have used it though.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: The Skarzs on September 18, 2014, 03:59:10 PM
They burned the building; nothing was said about the land around it.
Speaking of such, do you think BJ intentionally had St. Ninian's burned to remove it's possibility of being part of his later stories?
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Tam and Martin on September 18, 2014, 04:00:25 PM
Not too sure. He wasn't really using it in any of the books besides Redwall so he may have just decided to get it out of the story.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: The Skarzs on September 18, 2014, 04:03:18 PM
Yeah.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Tam and Martin on September 18, 2014, 04:06:47 PM
That or he just wanted something dramatic to happen at Redwall Abbey because all the excitement was at Sampetra  :P
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: SilentSam on November 03, 2014, 05:47:07 PM
I would think that Redwallers were buried at the church, or there was somehow some random graveyard that was never mentioned, but I doubt that there was a graveyard that was never mentioned.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Delthion on November 03, 2014, 09:02:12 PM
But don't forget where they buried the Galloper in Rakkety Tam, forget his name but he had a twin sister. I really need to read this series again.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Nadaz, voice of the host on November 05, 2017, 10:13:08 PM
where in the abbey grounds did they bury rollo's mom and the friar in mattimeo? I know it was in the abbey but I don't think they said where.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: The Skarzs on November 05, 2017, 11:15:51 PM
Yeah, I don't remember either.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Krantor the Brutal on November 06, 2017, 12:08:04 AM
Most abbeys have a cemetery, so logically they were buried in one.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Ashleg on November 06, 2017, 05:41:26 PM
Lots of characters were buried under a tree. Or on a hill, or in a garden, or near a lake, or...you get the idea. In weird places they thought the dead creature would like to have been or did like in their lifetime.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Sanddunes on November 06, 2017, 10:04:55 PM
I wander if anyone does cremation now the woodlanders would most like burn the Vermin bodies after a battle
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Ashleg on November 06, 2017, 10:33:17 PM
I thought they threw them in one giant pit and covered it.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: DelenatheWanderer on November 07, 2017, 05:23:32 PM
Has anyone thought about how many are buried on the Abby grounds? How many Dibbuns do you think have asked "Oi, Muver Abbess, marm, who's buried under that tree?"
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Ashleg on November 07, 2017, 05:24:51 PM
What if Redwall is like Paris with the catacombs, and it is structurally atop a massive graveyard.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Krantor the Brutal on November 07, 2017, 05:37:00 PM
Like where Martin's tomb is?
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Ashleg on November 07, 2017, 05:37:34 PM
Sort of. But more.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Wylder Treejumper on November 07, 2017, 06:50:03 PM
Well, with the cellars, and the tunnels from Doomwyte, and the remains of Castle Kotir, I doubt there is enough room for any catacombs. As a matter of fact, there is enough underground that I am surprised Redwall is structurally sound- it must have had an incredible amount of foundation work done. Moles do know their trade, though.


I think it's more likely that beasts which die in Redwall are buried out in the forest, or in a miscellaneous natural setting, than in a grave. Redwallers have a much more naturalistic lifestyle, so I think the idea of "returning them to nature" is reasonable for the setting (and I think it happens several times throughout the series). This would explain why Redwall has no graveyard.
Title: Re: Graves.
Post by: Grond on November 13, 2017, 04:30:51 AM
Quote from: Wylder Treejumper on November 07, 2017, 06:50:03 PM
Well, with the cellars, and the tunnels from Doomwyte, and the remains of Castle Kotir, I doubt there is enough room for any catacombs. As a matter of fact, there is enough underground that I am surprised Redwall is structurally sound- it must have had an incredible amount of foundation work done. Moles do know their trade, though.


I think it's more likely that beasts which die in Redwall are buried out in the forest, or in a miscellaneous natural setting, than in a grave. Redwallers have a much more naturalistic lifestyle, so I think the idea of "returning them to nature" is reasonable for the setting (and I think it happens several times throughout the series). This would explain why Redwall has no graveyard.

I think I mentioned this in another thread regarding graves, but the problem I have with the idea that Redwallers are buried in the forest or in a miscellaneous place is that every Redwaller that I can think of who died on Abbey grounds and whose burial/grave site was revealed had been buried within Abbey grounds. Redwallers who died outside of the Abbey were buried in misc. places close to their place of death- but this is probably due to the difficulties of transporting a dead body absent pack animals or vehicles or refrigeration...